According to Robert Kraft:
"Heil Hitler": NOT ANTISEMITIC
"Free Palestine": ANTISEMITIC

@anemone antisemitism we can use vs people talking about bad stuff we do.

@anemone well, Hitler is dead. they are still working on Palestinians

@sun @anemone

When people say "Free Palestine" ask them what exactly that means, and most Palestinians will unfortunately say it means the destruction of Israel, and Palestinians ruling the entire region, with Jews either under their rule, or gone.

Would strongly recommend watching some of the videos here:

https://youtube.com/@CoreyGilShusterAskProject

@taylan @anemone the best they can expect is a non-discriminatory two state solution and no genocide, which is tbh a pretty reasonable ask

@sun @taylan @anemone Decolonization is not a metaphor.

@sun @anemone

They really don't want that. They prefer to keep waging war.

I'm generalizing and there's of course those who would accept it, but the overall sentiment in their society, which has also been reflected in election results (choosing Hamas) is that they'd rather die than allow Israel to exist. It's an incredibly frustrating situation.

@sun@shitposter.world @taylan@fedi.feministwiki.org Israel has zero interest in letting that happen and it would result in a civil war even if they did since the west bank has over 200k settlers all over at this point

@taylan @anemone @sun
>with Jews either under their rule, or gone.
sounds awesome. whens #freetheworld coming?

@subnetter @anemone @sun

A colony is when foreigners exert power over your country and extract its resources. Israel isn't a colony; it's just where Jews live now. (And they had lived there before but that's not relevant either way IMO.)

@subnetter @anemone @taylan the current state isn't morally justifiable and it would be morally justified in replacing it completely with a different one that is not an ethnostate but two state I think for decades people think is the best idea that's conceivably doable.

@sun @anemone @taylan @subnetter the side with the Jews can be Big Saint James

@feld @anemone @taylan @subnetter that's america

@anemone @taylan the settlements are working exactly as planned. abolishing the entire state was unthinkable but they made it so you essentially have to do that anyway to get any justice at all with the settlements and the hope is now people will just do the math and let israel finish the job

@sun @anemone @taylan @subnetter two states and no ethnostate sounds like the worst possible option for Israel

@pettanko@tsundere.love @sun@shitposter.world @taylan@fedi.feministwiki.org @subnetter@shitposter.world good

@anemone @sun

After Oct 7 it's impossible anyway, but over the decades Israel has been a lot more open to the idea of a peaceful two state solution and willing to accept compromise.

It's sadly generally been rejected by the broad population of Arabs/Muslims, due to Islamic and Arab-supremacist mythology.

Mixed into that is also some anti-imperialist mythology, where Israel is seen as "evil westerners taking our land" despite Jews being indigenous to the region and a large portion of Israel's population consisting of Jews who moved there from neighbouring Muslim countries in which they were less safe.

Western leftists, being stupid about Islam, have chosen to pretend as if the main reason isn't just religious zealotry and antisemitism of Muslims, and have instead focused purely on the anti-imperialist myth, which to be fair is at least a half-truth given that Israel is allies with "the west."

@taylan @anemone @subnetter @sun
Originally Palestine was under british mandate and reluctantly let jews into it, but then zionist militias radicalized, got armed by the soviet union, and fucked over the brits and the arab palestinians. Technically they were anti-colonial terrorists that overtook some institutions of british colonialism. It's like when you hop into an MMORPG and see the unemployed beat some elder dragon or something and then you drop by out of nowhere for the last hit and get all the rare loot out of it

@subnetter @anemone @taylan @sun
niggas who say this are usually white

@taylan @anemone @sun self-described "male feminist" is also gigantic zionist who would've thought

@dagda @anemone @taylan @sun

I'm not, but my point is that a two state solution isn't possible on either end.

@anemone @sun @taylan
If only there were people not interested in being cannon fodder for Hamas / Iran or the IDF. But no, Israel doesn't have class struggle, they're all hopeless lunatics so sad

@dagda @anemone @taylan I learned a lot more about why palestinians voted in hamas and at this point I am pretty sure it was because at the time palestinian authority was totally corrupt and totally a tool of israel and they were trying to get out from under that, not hamas exterminationist founding beliefs. but of course those came along for the ride.

@subnetter @anemone @taylan @sun
so is any meaningful advancement in palestinian sovereignty without concessions to Israel, but considering that the Likud has a major nerf for coming elections now, considering the Haaretz reports of Netanjahu having known about the october 7th attack beforehand Israeli workers could grow more antagonistic towards military service

@sun @anemone @taylan
After Oslo the PLO / Fatah gave up lots of leverage yes, the settlers in westbank ran wild

@subnetter @anemone @taylan @dagda @sun total kike death :)

@dagda @anemone @subnetter @sun

To be fair to the Zionists of that period, if some of the planet's major forces had just tried to wipe me out completely, I'd also be radicalised and fight to create a little space for myself to be safe in.

Despite what many anti-Zionists say, I don't think the founding of Israel had to do with Jewish supremacism or religious zealotry nearly as much as "ok, we really need a country for ourselves, to survive."

@taylan @anemone @dagda @subnetter the pre-foundation zionist movement and the exact details of the foundation and maintenance of the state of israel are not exactly the same thing and often not even the same people.

@taylan @anemone @subnetter @sun
I use radicalization and terrorism as neutral non-moralistic descriptors
Just a glimpse into my twisted zoomer brain

@taylan @anemone @sun >After Oct 7 it's impossible anyway, but over the decades Israel has been a lot more open to the idea of a peaceful two state solution and willing to accept compromise.

yeah they'll "compromise" and then turn another village into rubble anyway

@taylan @sun @anemone yes, free palestine

@anemone because hitler is quarter jew?

@pernia @anemone @taylan @sun theyre moving to florida

@pernia @anemone @sun @taylan americas dobg is gonna contract yids

@taylan @anemone @subnetter @sun where are the bees sending the honey

@taylan @sun

but over the decades Israel has been a lot more open to the idea of a peaceful two state solution and willing to accept compromise.

LMAO

@gav @anemone @taylan @sun everywhere sunny they're moving. central america argentina mexico etc. also curiously far away from israel's jericho icmb's

@sun @anemone @taylan @dagda
In the 1970s and 1980s, Israel did provide funding and tacit support to the Muslim Brotherhood network in Gaza (the precursor to Hamas) as a counterweight to the PLO and Fatah.
Israel's goal was to weaken Fatah's dominance and divide Palestinian politics, not to have Hamas win an election against the PLO. The strategy backfired
en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Israeli_…
log in walled > theintercept.com/2018/02/19/ha…

@zer0unplanned @anemone @dagda @sun

As far as I can tell Mehdi Hasan is just an insane ideologue. And Wikipedia is just the mouthpiece of insane ideologues when it comes to "leftist causes."

I can take these conspiracy theories about as seriously as "Jews did 9/11."

@pernia @anemone @taylan @sun boomer taste

@taylan @sun @anemone @dagda Maybe learn to read a page..? click references or scroll down and 1st one you'll see is an article of The Times of Israel with 79 other sources you can check> argue them, not me. I'm mostly not in the mood to with pro Zionist people.

@zer0unplanned @anemone @dagda @sun

Clicking on the first source:

> Hamas was also included in discussions about increasing the number of work permits Israel granted to Gazan laborers, which kept money flowing into Gaza, meaning food for families and the ability to purchase basic products. Israeli officials said these permits, which allow Gazan laborers to earn higher salaries than they would in the enclave, were a powerful tool to help preserve calm.

So, if Israel allows Gazans to do conduct business, it means Israel supports Hamas.

If Israel didn't allow Gazans to conduct business, it would be accused of starving Gazans to death by denying them the fundamental human right to work and earn money.

Whatever Israel does, insane ideologues will find some way to paint it as an evil act of genocidal intent. The fact this kind of drivel is published by The Times of Israel is not proof that it's a solid critique of Israel; it's just proof that Israel is a pluralistic society with a free press, that allows its independent journalists to criticize their own government in even the most illogical ways. (Meanwhile, try to publicly criticize Hamas in Gaza...)