I ain't ate, fuck not having eaten. I'm gonna go get fried chicken grease all over my fuckin' DevTerm and then it will taste good later this evening.

@p waterproof laptops when so you can clean stuff like food grease

@lanodan Was joke about licking DevTerm.

@lanodan But the old IBM Model M keyboards were waterproof. Friend of mine cleans his in the dishwasher.

@pernia I am not gonna do a chewnoises-reveal tonight.

@p Huh, I guess because it was somewhat industrial-grade

@p @lanodan it's finger lickin' good?

@coolboymew @p Or he just wants to lewd the DevTerm

@lanodan I think it was that computers weren't considered disposable in the 80s: you got one and then you had it.

@lanodan @coolboymew I am going to do that but if it tastes like chicken grease that's even better.

@p Or more like corporation bought one/few for a glorious amount of money

@lanodan All the 80s machines were like that, though. Most NESs still work; you can't say the same for most PS3s or XBones. I have this Trash 80 and it's still fine. It works great. I have posted to fedi using it.
fedi.jpeg

@p And well most 80's gear is repairable in the rare event it breaks.
In fact pretty much why I'm trying* to get a MNT Reform Next, solid and repairable, unlike my thinkpad T495 that seems to be on it's last months after 5 years of using it at mostly home.

*fucking payment processors

@p @lanodan Commodore 64s seem to be pretty bad for the SIDs and some other chips failing. At least they’re swappable and there are people making replacements for them though.

@gray @p Yeah, meanwhile it's pretty much unthinkable to swap a chip on modern machines unless you're like an actual repair workshop.

@gray @lanodan Oh, MOSFETs, I believe it.

@p @lanodan my Newton MP2100 and Psion Organiser II XP still work perfectly, as does the "Fat Mac", SE/30, Duo 230, and Mac "luggable" portable. Even the NeXTs still run just fine. About the only crufty bits are the HDDs, and the monorchrome NeXT monitor -- the color one is just fine.

Once upon a time, expensive things were expected to last. Now you can get a $200 laptop, but it'll likely be dead in < 5 years.

@jeremiah @lanodan

> Even the NeXTs still run just fine.

I have envy.

> About the only crufty bits are the HDDs,

Can they netboot?

> Once upon a time, expensive things were expected to last. Now you can get a $200 laptop, but it'll likely be dead in < 5 years.

Try "some dingus buys a $1500 phone and it doesn't last 2 years".

@p @lanodan expensive phones are a retard tax, whether it's status, or spending enough time on the phone for some twiddly detail to justify hundreds of dollars of overspending.

@jeremiah @lanodan Ha, I should have skipped the bit about the phone since the netboot thing was the relevant part.

Apparently they can at least netboot NetBSD: https://www.netbsd.org/docs/network/netboot/intro.next68k.html . How much of it still applies is open to speculation, as they link to a site that hasn't been up since 2004: https://web.archive.org/web/20040605093635/http://www.peanuts.org:80/faq-serve/cache/189.html

@p @lanodan there are adaptors to connect modern monitors to color NeXTen. I've seen some wacky hardware built around Raspberry PIs to do the same for monochrome, but cannot remember where.
https://www.nextcomputers.org/forums/index.php?topic=89.0

@jeremiah @lanodan Have gotten distracted; a computer just told me that 2025 is *preposterous* and it's not wrong.

https://archive.org/details/NeXTSTEP33CISC
preposterous.png

@p @lanodan not Y2K compliant. One of the last updates for the NeXT (from Apple, no less) was a patch from apple to fix this and related issues with OpenStep and I believe NextStep 3.3.

@jeremiah @lanodan Well, I can't get it to understand the CD-ROM drive so I decided not to get too distracted.

It is kind of ridiculous that the last few years of qemu have made it really hard to say "look just make it a regular-ass computer"; you've got to specify the bus for the network card, you've got to specify the bus for the floppy drive if you want to write to the boot sector.

I bet if I booted up (or chrooted into, or fiddled with /etc/ld.so.conf and reran ldconfig, etc.) an old disk image that would run old qemu, it would boot the dang installer.

@p @jeremiah Well for old systems (specially with Y2K issues in the mix) might be better to use https://github.com/86Box/86Box anyway.

@lanodan @jeremiah Figure I'll have a better chance if I just use bochs, but a better idea is to not get further distracted.

@p @jeremiah Interestingly I think I never used bochs.
And looking in logs it seems like it failed to build the two times I tried to install it.

@lanodan @jeremiah It's an emulator targeting accuracy. One of the really early ones available for Linux; there's some cruft. It was unusably slow most of the time, then qemu came out and it was speedy, then it got KVM (which was called "qemu-accel" or something until it got open), and bochs kind of fell by the wayside unless you were lurking around osdev circles.

bochs is the one you use if you want a machine that acts like an old computer. I've heard of 86box but I haven't used it; I hear good things about it.

@p @lanodan
My refurbished Xbox One still works fine. I wonder what would happen to it if Microsoft ever goes down and takes their account services offline. Thing seems completely useless about it!
I've seen reports of people successfully installing normal desktop Windows on them, but I've never seen any guides — not sure if that is real or just someone's wishful thinking.

@m0xEE @lanodan No Red Ring of Death yet, eh?

> I wonder what would happen to it if Microsoft ever goes down and takes their account services offline.

It's why I don't purchase such things. I don't know how much the refurb was but it'd have to be cheap, I think.

@gray @p @lanodan That was mostly because Commodore didn't know what heatsinks were. The modern WDC W65C02S is mostly pin-compatible with the old MOS 6502.

Mid-80's computers are one of the last ones you can probably still mostly rebuild with modern new parts without redesigning half of it. The chip designs became so popular that demand still did not stop. Heck, I think Zilog discontinued manufacturing of the Z80 only last year.

@jeremiah @p @lanodan
>Now you can get a $200 laptop, but it'll likely be dead in < 5 years.
You would think, but reality is probably only one year (or whatever is the minimum warranty) + few weeks.

I bought my current Leninovo laptop for around 1400USD and the keyboard started to fail almost perfectly 2 years after it was first started.

@phnt @p @lanodan @jeremiah I remember having to replace the keyboard assembly on my old Thinkpad T60p and it was just a couple of screws. Probably only took a couple minutes. I don’t know how it is on modern Thinkpads but it is probably worse.

@gray @p @lanodan @jeremiah On newer ThinkPads they went back to the keyboard being a separate serviceable part I think. But on my IdeaPad, you have to replace the whole top case which means disassembling the whole laptop. You can't buy the replacement top case from Lenovo directly after being 2 years on the market anyway. There is not such thing as a good laptop these days. Even Framework is scummy.

@phnt @gray @jeremiah @lanodan

> There is not such thing as a good laptop these days.

I used to think that.

Used to.
eks.jpeg

@p @gray @phnt @lanodan @jeremiah are you browing fedi on that?

@lucy @gray @jeremiah @lanodan @phnt Sometimes. I have today. It runs Firefox so it's not any different.

@p @gray @lanodan @jeremiah
I would really like to have one.

If could even buy one that is.

@phnt @gray @jeremiah @lanodan They are for sale. uConsole takes longer but they can be bought.

@phnt @gray @p @jeremiah On my T495 (so ThinkPad™ at least in name) I could get both the keyboard and fan (+heatsink bundled with it, how wasteful) replaced after about 3 years.
Which is the warranty I had with it.

So on parts replacement I can't really say anything about lenovo, that part still works, Framework is just more parts replacement with basically everything custom and tight so in terms of actual repair or aftermarket parts… yikes.

@lanodan @gray @phnt @p I've got two x220ts, both of which are still operating perfectly on their original parts. One runs nixos/kde, the other runs HaikuOS (and is the designated parts donor should that become necessary.)

Only the battery packs have to be re-celled every couple of years, otherwise, all original.

@lanodan @gray @p @jeremiah My issue with Framework isn't that everything is custom. At least they give actual schematics to repair centers if they ask for them (supposedly). My issue with them is they refuse to send you replacement parts, if you used a forwarding service because you live in a country they don't ship in (half of Europe), even if you already payed them. I can't think of a single excuse for that behavior. It's not like you asked them to honor warranty which they would probably reject.

@phnt @gray @p @lanodan @jeremiah mnt reform to the rescue!

@phnt @gray @p @jeremiah Like they're preventing the parts from being forwarded as well?

And well… I kind of wish there would be at least some basic warranty if your current country ends up in their no-ship list.

@menherahair @gray @phnt @p @jeremiah Maybe via their website it works worldwide but Crowdsupply (relevant for the Reform Next) also does no-ship (and here I got in payment processor issues, I need to call bank or something but I bloody hate phones).

@menherahair @gray @jeremiah @p @phnt Huh, well somehow today it worked so should have an MNT Reform Next (with 32GB of RAM) in some months.

@lanodan @gray @p @jeremiah

Like they're preventing the parts from being forwarded as well?

No, there have been a few cases where a customer used a forwarding service to purchase a laptop from them, it gets delivered fine and when you want replacement parts, your order will get rejected after payment (refund included).

There also used to be an issue where they only delivered to Germany/Poland and banned forwarding within EU which apparently is illegal.

Armenia forwarding case: https://linustechtips.com/topic/1530085-framework-and-freight-forwarding-dont-ever-leave-your-country-fw-anon/
EU forwarding before policy revision: https://linustechtips.com/topic/1532966-frameworks-toc-are-breaching-european-union-geoblocking-laws/

Framework documents regarding this: https://knowledgebase.frame.work/does-framework-support-freight-forwarding-of-products-to-unsupported-countries-regions-SJFhK43x9
https://knowledgebase.frame.work/eu-unsupported-SJByUb7a

And well… I kind of wish there would be at least some basic warranty if your current country ends up in their no-ship list. In the second LTT forums thread, OP says that even "carrying the laptop into unsupported country" void warranty. (Couldn't verify this claim.)

I sort of understand them for not providing warranty outside supported regions because legalities are a nightmare.

---

That said, I won't buy anything from them anyway since they are way overpriced for what they sell anyway and demonstrated that repairability isn't always their priority with the AI desktop that has basically nothing repairable (CPU soldered, RAM soldered/on SoC). A decommissioned ThinkPad from some random company is more repairable then their products and also much cheaper.

@lanodan @gray @jeremiah @p s/refund included/payment refunded/

@phnt @gray @p @jeremiah Worst for me about soldered CPU/RAM is like, I can understand it a bit specially on laptops, but then at least put the CPU+RAM on a module so you don't put everything on a gigantic mainboard and they can still be replaced (specially with warranty where you'd send back the old module).
Although at least on Framework the mainboard has a bit of separation from ports so stress on those shouldn't end up damaging the mainboard, thinkpads where even the charging port is soldered… yeah never again.

@phnt @gray @p @jeremiah
[from the linustechtips forum post, linked above]
> After an audit of our outstanding orders, it was determined that you entered false billing information, are utilizing a PO Box/Post Office delivery, or are utilizing a freight forwarder with the intent to ship our product to an unsupported country/region.

What the fuck, "PO Box" as well? Can't really understand the reason for this, seems rather anti-privacy to me and if you're in a building without a proper box (sometimes impossible if it's really old), then you can't receive parts either…

@lanodan @gray @p @jeremiah
>I can understand it a bit specially on laptops, but then at least put the CPU+RAM on a module so you don't put everything on a gigantic mainboard
That would also enable easy upgradeability which is also something I miss from modern laptops. Like half of them don't even have replaceable SSDs anymore. And in the case of storage speed is not an excuse for that. Nobody needs 15GB/s transfers on their laptop.

The Compute Modules is also one thing RPi did right until they made them worse with the release of CM4. The new connectors are meh.

>What the fuck, "PO Box" as well? Can't really understand the reason for this, seems rather anti-privacy...
I don't understand why they are so defensive/secretive about these things. Like rejecting Post Office delivery to me means that I can't let them leave it a local post office. Now what if I'm not home at the time of arrival, or I'm at work... It makes no sense to me.

@phnt @gray @p @lanodan @jeremiah SSDs are literally the one thing not soldered in newer laptops, at least of the ones I repaired, and that's because if Lenovo/Dell did that their customer base would kick their ass IRL because board swaps would be a disaster and ditto with data privacy.

A friend told me that they donate PC laptops but destroy Macs due to this very reason.

@phnt @gray @p @jeremiah Well if you're not home I think all courriers leave it in a nearby warehouse where either you have to ask them to a new shipping date (or sometimes automatically tried the next day), or go at the warehouse and take it there.

@sendpaws @gray @p @lanodan @jeremiah I did not look for like a year at laptops, but it used to be kinda hard to find a consumer laptop with a non-soldered SSD. Of course that won't fly on business laptops, but not many people will pay 2x extra for a business laptop. Unless they are an Apple customer.

>A friend told me that they donate PC laptops but destroy Macs due to this very reason.
Yes, that's true. They use a drill on the SSDs and depending on how competent the people doing that are, they will drill through the keyboard and screen without disassembling it at all.

@sendpaws @gray @phnt @p @jeremiah PCs getting donated reminds me of schools selling their old computers for dirt cheap enough that students could buy them with their pocket money.
I wouldn't be surprised if this isn't a thing anymore due to hecking chromebooks getting everywhere.

@p @lanodan It really depends, the SNES has a talked about problem with chips dying. There are many posts on the SNES subreddit with "my SNES is doing this funky shit is the PPU/CPU dying?"

They're as bad as C64s are with chip death IMO
https://www.projectvb.com/nss/logs.htm

@lanodan @gray @phnt @p @jeremiah on newer thinkpads with the exception of the T14 series (not the T14s) and mobile workstations (many of them that is), it's still easy.

On numerous modern ThinkPads it's a top palmrest cover swap as it's "fused", it's not on many Dells but the new keyboard never ever seems to "fit" right.

@phnt @gray @p @lanodan I've heard in these cases it's manufacturing flaws, like one such flaw with East European chips I read about was where the wires inside the package to the die would physically disconnect from the die.

@lanodan @gray @phnt @p @jeremiah It's not just Chromebooks, it's also the Microsoft Sysadmin (tm) who read in his CompTIA+ and Microsoft Certified Admin course that any old computer has data or something and they all must be crushed.

Though Chromebooks aren't so bad if they unlink them from the accounts when they're disposed of (you will NEVER guess what these same admins also fail to do!)

@sendpaws @gray @p @lanodan Could also be. MOS was known for horrible quality in the early years.

@lanodan @gray @p @sendpaws @jeremiah In Czechia Chromebooks in schools are basically non-existant. I've never seen one in schools or used by kids for school. Classrooms still have normal towers and it's expected around the 4th year that kids will have access to a computer at home instead.

@phnt @gray @p @lanodan @jeremiah they're cheap too when kids do public schooler activites to them too

@sendpaws @phnt @p @lanodan @jeremiah The Thinkpad L14 has dual RAM slots and an SSD slot.

@sendpaws @gray @p @lanodan @jeremiah When kids in public schools are doing this, a lot of pieces start to make sense now. At least I'm in the generation where people before me barely knew how to use a computer and those that come after me also have no clue.

Job security 100

@phnt @gray @p @sendpaws @lanodan ... despite millions (billions?) of dollars in in ipads and chromebooks.

@jeremiah @gray @phnt @p @lanodan It makes sense when you realize it's not about teaching stuff but about doing so and so because Pearson or someone slipped the school a nice phat paycheck or something, or some boomers saying "we need to teach kids computers but we need to be Up To Date (tm)"

Aside from this coming from me "knowing" people in the field; it's also from what I saw in schools: giving middle schoolers N-Spire CASes. You already know why.

@lanodan @phnt @gray @jeremiah

> with the intent to ship our product to an unsupported country/region

@sendpaws @gray @phnt @p @lanodan it's a problem inasmuch as spyware (mickysoft/crapple/google's and/or the school's) is being foisted upon people who are legally incapable of being bound by a contract (EULA, etc.)

@lanodan @gray @phnt @p it's literally antiprivacy because the point to this and the current software regimes is the elimination of privacy and turning systems into a user observatory.

@sendpaws @gray @phnt @p @lanodan i'm unironically in favor of kids destroying school supplied individual tablets and laptops. I'd prefer they did it for an informed reason, but any limited-scope destruction (eg, not starting a fire that spreads) is acceptable imnsho.

@sendpaws @gray @phnt @p @lanodan i once worked for Pearson on "interactive media". Can confirm.

@jeremiah @gray @phnt @p @lanodan if you know anyone who is in the education industry as a teacher they will 100% say the same shit about it being pushed from the top

@sendpaws @gray @phnt @p @lanodan brother and his wife are former teachers (not retired, quit) who complained bitterly about the things pushed from the top, the pushers, and the lack of accountability for the consequences of pushing.

I maintain that public schools are literally evil and public education should be defunded.

Check out John Taylor Gatto if you've not heard of him:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=eP98ZKt709A

@jeremiah @gray @phnt @p @sendpaws I was a student at a freinet-style High School ("Lycée Expérimental de Saint-Nazaire" if you want to look it up). Classes attended voluntarily and co-made by student and teachers, discussions and tables organised like a round-table conference, …

I don't think it should be defunded though, but I think it ought to be self-organised quite like public libraries tend to be (in fact probably why Ivan Illich favored those over schools).

@lanodan @gray @phnt @p @sendpaws that's idealistic, but unreasonable. The purpose to public education is to shape people for the use of the state. Gatto demonstrates it's origin in Prussia to develop soldiers that would follow orders run towards the cannons, and even today (US), the military has special access to student dossiers.

I went to an private school, and also a public high school. I could see the night and day difference in approaches and results.

I maintain that so long as the state manages education, it will always manage it to serve its purposes, even if there are a handful of exceptional schools supported by public funds.

<vitriol>Public schools do not offer refunds for poor education, and are not accountable for damage to students, or their reduced possibilities, or their wasted time. The time to end public education was before it began.</vitriol>

@jeremiah @lanodan @gray @phnt @sendpaws

> The time to end public education was before it began.

You might not be surprised to find the UN (and thus Roosevelt, Rockefeller, Dulles, Bernays) came out the gate swinging on the "right to compulsory education". I'm familiar with the bit about Prussia, but this is not the same deal, it's worse: they don't have a reason to harass the Amish to get into the schoolhouse if they're just looking for cannon fodder. The plan has been, from the beginning, organizing society top-down.

@jeremiah @gray @phnt @p @sendpaws Well private schools usually have the same bullshit because of national exams, which so far are the only thing I've seen them sell.

After all you're even pointing yourself as something with results, which to me is bullshit when it comes to education.

For example if you take languages, sure you can measure how fluent someone is, but good luck measuring anything past that in a way that's objective rather than "I want you to learn this piece of language tidbit".

@lanodan @gray @phnt @p @sendpaws @jeremiah what if there were no retarded blacks

@vicious @lanodan @gray @jeremiah @phnt @sendpaws Yeah, that's the main problem, that's why the school system is such shit, Woodrow Wilson was a black man, black people invented the IMF.

God damn, are *you* retarded?

@lanodan @gray @phnt @p @sendpaws ours did not participate in national exams, did not have grades, and rejected standardized testing.

By results, I'm not referring to myself specifically, but to the general trend of producing self-made, independent people that went on to do interesting things and be interesting people, along with the usual measures of "success."

A large part of that was project-based education that gave a lot of us a tremendous head-start on things that matter than, as you say, learning tidbits. It was an entirely different approach to education that necessary produced different (and typically superior) results.

@p @gray @phnt @sendpaws @lanodan @jeremiah you're confusing the error with the target like a tranny,

@vicious @gray @jeremiah @lanodan @phnt @sendpaws They still lived on plantations when these wheels started spinning, you Velveeta motherfucker.

@p @gray @phnt @sendpaws @lanodan it's not the same deal, but it's the same ideal: as you say, to control people. A program that can convince people to run headlong into cannonfire on the sayso of some asshat is clearly applicable to the goal of top-down organization and control.

@jeremiah @gray @p @phnt @sendpaws Also something that might need to be clarified, I mean public as in "everyone has the rights for it" (at least in the right age-range), the funds do not have to be managed by politicians, in fact I think they must not be.

@phnt @gray @lanodan @p

Using FPGAs in of rapid switching chips (like the CIA/1570 swap) helps greatly.

@p @gray @phnt @sendpaws @lanodan @jeremiah blacks literally kill each other every day so who cares? You're an idiot

@vicious @gray @p @sendpaws @lanodan @jeremiah
brave-schizos-of-online.jpeg

@vicious @gray @jeremiah @lanodan @phnt @sendpaws The fuck does that have to do with anything? The fuck does complaining to me about it get you? Did whining about it solve the problem?

I'm goddamn sick of you people, you know? Fix something or build something or learn to cope. BAWWWWWWWing on the internet is not gonna goddamn help you. Nothing can help you: you're a hapless victim, not because of circumstance, but because of temperament. You will always be unhappy: figure out how to cope or dangle your feet over an upturned chair. Neither is my goddamn problem.

No more warning shots.
putinnuke.gif

@p
Yeah, this is exactly how it was — I got it on a whim, one day I was like: I really want to play Halo 5! And I got a refurbished console with the game because the discount was good. Turned out fine — other than having a giant sticker on it claiming it's refurbished, I don't think it was different from a brand new one in any way. RRoD was a problem with original Xbox 360 batch, I don't think Xbox One ever had such issues, there was a problem with my unit emitting a high-pitched noise when updating at night time, as the console is in deep sleep mode even its fans are off so it's very noticeable. At first I thought that it might be a problem with my unit as it's refurbished, but turned out it's a common problem — since then they have either fixed it with an update or they have just stopped releasing patches that often and the problem became less prominent.
Other than that — no issues at all. I'm not such an avid gamer, but I have it for about 9 years, it got borrowed by my friends on several occasions, so it has seen some shit and still works — I doubt anything would happen to it at this point. In fact, I think buying used or refurbished is the safer route with modern hardware: if it didn't break down immediately, it means that it's very likely to do so after the warranty expires — and when you're buying used, even that didn't happen. And with refurbished units — people seem to be cautious about such things, but to me it means it did break down from the get-go, but original manufacturer has taken a second look at it and fixed it, if some parts in that revision turn out likely to be faulty, they usually also get replaced.

@lanodan

@lanodan @gray @phnt @p @sendpaws here, politicians are the ones with the ability to collect taxes and disperse them as fund to any given program. Not sure how else you could do it with public money and make it a right.

@p @gray @phnt @sendpaws @lanodan @jeremiah we're talking about how education isn't doing so well and you're pretending like it isn't because of retarded niggers like wtf are you even on about? Are you actually retarded?

@vicious @gray @phnt @p @sendpaws @lanodan most of us are talking about education. you're talking about retarded niggers. It's two different conversations.

Public schools were awful when segregated, and they're awful now that they're semi-integrated. Basketball Americans are not a key issue unless you're talking about school violence or DEI shit.

@jeremiah @gray @vicious @phnt @p @lanodan If you want a funny story before Chromebooks on how public schools work, just look into the whole story of Channel One.

Channel One was a program where schools would get free TVs wired into the classroom, headend units for the entire school with VCRs, and satellite receivers for a catch: you had to show Channel One to your class.

Channel One was a news program that notoriously had advertisements pumped into classrooms and this made the parents of the 90s (who also killed Saturday Morning Cartoons for the same reason btw) really pissed off back when they weren't pacified and docile. Much of it was also very consumerist in a way, and there were documentaries like Captive Audience based on their business model.

It also didn't go so well with many teachers and while the public school had us watching it in the 2010s, someone I know in a private school told me that they would just show it before students came to class to fulfill that obligation. Kind of like the whole thing with ABC Family and showing the 700 Club at midnight hours (since the former owners included that in the clause).

Yet schools bought into it, hook line and sinker, because they wanted the free stuff.

https://www.ibiblio.org/commercialfree/channelone.html
https://www.foxnews.com/us/nonprofit-urges-schools-to-ban-channel-one-newscast-over-onslaught-of-commercials

There were also many cases of computers being offered to schools for sweet discounts, from Apple computers until the 00s to Acorns in the UK. The idea is that you'd use the Apple II/Mac at school, and buy the Mac at home.

@jeremiah @gray @vicious @phnt @p @lanodan The other thing is that before lockdowns, parents were absent from their kids life in schools. Schools were where their kids were sent, and parents had no idea what was going on in schools either because they were at work or home while the kid was in class.

Remote schooling is when parents began to learn what their kids were really being taught, and it really didn't sit well with many. It's definitely a factor for the uptick in parents getting politically active again; and why the libsoftiktok formula of "this is what your teacher is posting on TikTok" really caught on hard. Parents absolutely hate when teachers take advantage of this.

@sendpaws @gray @vicious @phnt @p @lanodan Channel One was still operating in 2018.

There has always been efforts to get commercial content into schools -- the "Crest test" of the 1950s (https://repository.duke.edu/dc/adviews/dmbb36813) to Weekly Reader and Scholastic catalogs disguised as "magazines."

At our school, they brought in vending machines (coca cola, etc) to raise funds for athletics (irony much?). In retaliation some people I might have been counted among taught the fine art of "dollaring" the machines by using packing tape to make a dollar that you could yank back out of the machine after it credited you for a drink, and then get an additional fifty cents (the change for the dollar you yanked) for your trouble. This was not simple theft, but intentionally meant to teach the athletics department a lesson by making it cost them money rather than raising money (it worked.)

In the 90s, there all kinds of bizarre deals that branded the schools with various products (often soda) in exclusive arrangements in exchange for donations -- if the student consumption met sales quotas (this was parodied/presented in an episode of the Daria cartoon on MTV -- further irony.)

@jeremiah @gray @vicious @phnt @p @lanodan scholastic book fairs are still a thing btw but they have shit like manga now lmao

Kids here hated how soda machines were locked out during school days because in Ohio it's a god given right to drink Mountain Dew 24/7

@sendpaws @gray @vicious @phnt @p @lanodan judging by the screeching, teachers, teachers' unions , and school corporations also hated it. They were offering flimsy excuses as why parents could not watch or review the curriculum -- often copyright! There are many Randi Weingarten clips from the covid era are... educational.

@jeremiah @gray @vicious @phnt @p @lanodan It was a culture shock when I was at my last job, seeing stuff like pride flags and all up in middle schools when teachers would get on your ass for doing anything remotely sexual in schools just 10 years ago.

@jeremiah @gray @phnt @p @sendpaws @lanodan how were they awful before niggers?

@vicious @gray @phnt @p @sendpaws @lanodan this is detailed elsewhere in the thread.

@jeremiah @gray @phnt @p @sendpaws @lanodan ok where

@vicious @gray @phnt @p @sendpaws @lanodan is this your way of saying, "gibs me dat, it's hard to read a thread"?

@jeremiah @gray @phnt @p @sendpaws @lanodan I shouldn't have to read a ton of retarded bs for you to make a simple point

@vicious @gray @phnt @p @sendpaws @lanodan if you can't be bothered to read, it's not that important to you. I'll try not to notice that your complaint is very similar to "I ain't got no time for that sheeit."

@jeremiah @gray @phnt @p @sendpaws @lanodan yea there's literally over 100 retarded posts in this thread so yea im not reading every single one when you can't even make a simple point after reading the entire thread which you probably didn't anyway because you're obv retarded since you didn't learn anything apparently

@vicious @gray @phnt @p @sendpaws @lanodan coming from someone who can barely read and asks others to do the work for him, I'm not sure you're in a position to call anyone retarded.

@jeremiah @gray @phnt @p @sendpaws @lanodan make an actual point or fuck off retard

@jeremiah @gray @lanodan @p @phnt @sendpaws you're literally worse than a redditor, it's pathetic

@vicious @gray @phnt @p @lanodan @jeremiah

@sendpaws @gray @vicious @phnt @p @lanodan It also goes to show what a top-down situation it is -- all of this stuff erupted all at the same time, transnationally, going back to the part of this thread about schools being designed for top-down control and (if not stated explicitly) social engineering.

I was shocked when I went to vote and saw the lockers painted in pride colors at a public highschool.

Sending kids to a public school for the majority of their time (vs. time spent with family) is tantamount to child neglect.

There are also horrid things that happen at elite private schools, so perhaps all schooling without deep parental involvement and awareness is child neglect.

i want to play SUPER RIOT SUIT

@sendpaws @p @lanodan I have one with weird "minor" problems that are completely consistent in games. Radical Rex spawns 0 actors. Illusion of Gaia and Terranigma, which may share some level of engines, does not boot at all. Yoshi Island has occasional red sprites and some areas vertically scroll the TV output

Really weird shit. I should eventually attempt a Snes Test cart since I have a multicart now too see wtf is the problem

@coolboymew @p @lanodan yeah run the test cart but it seems like it might be chip failure of some sort, still you can weed out the issue by running tests.

Game logic issues are more likely to be weird CPU issues.

@vicious @gray @jeremiah @lanodan @phnt @sendpaws You goddamn retard, the system was fucked from the outset.

@vicious @jeremiah @gray @lanodan @phnt @sendpaws If you read the thread, you'd know.

@sendpaws @jeremiah @gray @vicious @phnt @lanodan

> Channel One was a program where schools would get free TVs wired into the classroom, headend units for the entire school with VCRs, and satellite receivers for a catch: you had to show Channel One to your class.

Also there was an Asian chick.

If I'm not mistaken, jeremiah is also old enough to have seen Channel One when it was live.

@vicious @jeremiah @gray @lanodan @phnt @sendpaws

> I shouldn't have to read a ton of retarded bs for you to make a simple point

Why repeat the entire goddamn thread just because someone that shows up is illiterate?

This is kind of self-defeating, since your point is that the reason the schools suck is that the students suck. Are there any black people here in the room right now, preventing you from reading the thread?

@vicious @jeremiah @gray @lanodan @phnt @sendpaws Quit whining or kill yourself. (Fixing whatever you are unhappy about is optional.)

@vicious @jeremiah @gray @lanodan @phnt @sendpaws

> make an actual point or fuck off retard

He was here in the thread before you wandered in to push your single issue.

This is the thing I was complaining about earlier: any time someone starts to talk about this topic, the top-down modernist approach to organizing society "scientifically", someone shows up to inject this kind of thing.
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@vicious @gray @jeremiah @lanodan @phnt @sendpaws
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@vicious @gray @phnt @p @sendpaws @lanodan your lack of attention span and "gibs" attitude is pathetic. I'm pretty sure your use of "nigger" is pure projection.

@jeremiah @gray @phnt @p @sendpaws @lanodan why can't you just make a point instead of crying and seething? like if its so obvious just say something that isn't retarded coping pls

@vicious @jeremiah @gray @lanodan @phnt @sendpaws This turns out to just be a respawn of bot.

@p @gray @vicious @sendpaws @lanodan @jeremiah Sort of tracks. Account went dark in December 2023, came back 3 months ago and now we have this constant complaining about trannies while calling almost everyone retarded.

Honestly if this is another bot alt, it is even shittier than the previous one.

Rated 3/10 Not enough 🔧

@p @sendpaws @gray @jeremiah @lanodan @phnt @vicious

We had that in our classes. I'll be honest, we tuned out out, the teachers didn't much care what we did. They used it as filler for 15 min they didn't have to teach. Drank coffee mostly. Except Mr. Scott. He drank coffee spiked with Grey Goose.

We caught him filling half his mug with it one morning.

Favorite teacher.

But as to the channel... I payed zero attention, I had magazines stuffed inside my Algebra book and was generally reading them instead of paying attention for sh*tty news.

@SilverDeth @gray @jeremiah @lanodan @phnt @sendpaws @vicious

> Except Mr. Scott. He drank coffee spiked with Grey Goose.

Real motherfuckers.

> But as to the channel... I payed zero attention, I had magazines stuffed inside my Algebra book and was generally reading them instead of paying attention for sh*tty news.

Yeah, likewise. I remember when Lisa Ling got shipped to Iraq and took photos of people's satellite dishes, which were illegal in Iraq at the time. Think this was shortly after Slick Willie had a pretend war with them.

@p @gray @vicious @phnt @sendpaws @lanodan this is why we can't have nice things.

@jeremiah @gray @lanodan @phnt @sendpaws @vicious Turns out it's a respawn of bot, and this is why it was just a retarded hop-on.

There is no way to make her understand that you do not want to talk to her. It just makes her double down.

@p @gray @phnt @sendpaws @lanodan I've found that muting it solved the problem.

We can continue having interesting, engaging conversations about computers, politics, and school -- and just play a bit of whack-a-mole with retards, bots, whatever.

I'm all for elevating the discourse defiantly.

@phnt @gray @jeremiah @lanodan @sendpaws @vicious I had a feeling that it was someone I knew, the posts were familiar. A dim spark of recognition. Decided it was not worth the time to think about it and I should just start firing wildly over my shoulder without aiming or looking. Then pwm or pernis or one of them (I muted that thread) said "hi bot" in the scrumble thread and it clicked.

> Not enough 🔧

It's like when eris respawned as book and I had the same reaction as I had to eris and then this "book" guy started screeching at me and him being eris slipped out. You can't actually be a different person: if you change your name, the same people will still like you and the same people will still dislike you. It's possible to get off on the wrong foot, sure, but after enough interactions, it's not a remotely likely case. Some people will not ever get along with each other. This is fine, the world is big, but there's some kind of sickness that makes people unable to accept it.
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@jeremiah @gray @lanodan @phnt @sendpaws

> I've found that muting it solved the problem.

Depends on how excited she gets.
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@p @gray @vicious @sendpaws @lanodan @jeremiah
>There is no way to make her understand that you do not want to talk to her.
Ignore him and you'll be 90% of the way there. The remaining can be solved by posting memes at him and not responding to anything. Or you can just mute and update the MRF, if you are more sane than me.

I'm still surprised his old macbook works since he can't buy a new one, because those have demonic sigils in the chips.
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@phnt @gray @jeremiah @lanodan @sendpaws @vicious

> Ignore him and you'll be 90% of the way there.

I have blocked, muted, instance-blocked, etc. She's persistent. I don't think anyone on fedi has spent as much time trying to talk to me; I understand she's like this with other people, too.

> Or you can just mute and update the MRF, if you are more sane than me.

I'd turned on the Strangelove bot before reading that this is bot. I'll update the MRF if the problem continues (the problem will continue but I like to give people a chance to surprise me by being less shitty than expected).

> I'm still surprised his old macbook works since he can't buy a new one, because those have demonic sigils in the chips.

HA, I am unfamiliar with this. (Please don't elaborate, I feel like if you explain it then it will be less funny.)
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@p @gray @vicious @sendpaws @lanodan @jeremiah
>I had a feeling that it was someone I knew, the posts were familiar.
>and it clicked.
Had the same feeling with ergo. His SPW account went dark 5 months ago. Then few weeks ago I saw him arguing with you about Japan in some thread and the name ergo seemed familiar. After reading his post that went along the lines of "you'll regret moving to Japan", it suddenly clicked since his shtick was complaining about Japanese people and work culture there.

https://shitposter.world/objects/9113dd35-1a88-4fb8-a126-fcf9f9e1f27e

>Awoo
Haven't seen in him in a very long time on feddy.

@phnt @gray @jeremiah @lanodan @sendpaws @vicious

> Then few weeks ago I saw him arguing with you about Japan in some thread

He's an interesting guy but he is unwilling to budge on this point. I like Japan; I don't think I'd like to live there for very long but it's a fine place, the people are cool.

>Awoo

That was actually Terry's avatar at the time.

If people stopped changing their abataps so much then the memes would stop becoming incomprehensible after a few weeks.

@p @gray @vicious @sendpaws @lanodan @jeremiah
>That was actually Terry's avatar at the time
Yeah, didn't notice the totenkopf cap. I'm just blind.

@p @gray @vicious @phnt @sendpaws @lanodan @jeremiah

I want to talk to her, i'm pretty sure @Soy_Magnus wouldn't mind either, don't be shy to ping us both if you'll have any issues with bot in the future 😊

@lonelyowl13 @gray @jeremiah @lanodan @phnt @sendpaws @vicious Nothing I can't handle, but thanks for the offer. Feel free to say hi to her: @vicious

I'll never forget vicious first became active a few weeks after bot mentioned using her "super secret" alt. At the time I thought "Huh, maybe she has an account where she just posts innocuous stuff" then immediately saw this account and went "Ah, of course."

The funny thing to me though (from my perspective) is it seemed she made that account after like 5-10 people started simping for her on every single post she made lmao.

Like when she'd do her usual arguing with someone 5-6 white knight types would flood the replies shit-talking the other guy and hard simping. I can imagine that gets fucking annoying if you're trying to troll.

@Kirino @lonelyowl13 @gray @vicious @phnt @p @sendpaws @lanodan @jeremiah Bot reminds me of the pet bunny we had. One hilarious thing about the nasty vegetarians is their tendency to turn into virgins with rage when they never have contact with a buck. Ours started to eat the little wooden house inside her cage. After a few months, she didn't fit in anymore, because it was half eaten.

@maxmustermann @lonelyowl13 @gray @vicious @p @sendpaws @lanodan @Kirino @jeremiah Bunnies have short temper even if you have two of them, female and male. They'll eat cables, furniture anyway. That's just who they are. It's like trying to prevent a cat from scratching everything. As far as I know one of the things that females will stop doing when they have a male near them is stomping and scratching on floors, but that's about it.
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@phnt @maxmustermann @Kirino @gray @jeremiah @lanodan @lonelyowl13 @sendpaws @vicious
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@p @lonelyowl13 @gray @vicious @phnt @sendpaws @lanodan @Kirino @jeremiah @maxmustermann oh God

@Economic_Hitman @Kirino @gray @jeremiah @lanodan @lonelyowl13 @maxmustermann @phnt @sendpaws @vicious Existential levels.

@maxmustermann @Kirino @gray @jeremiah @lanodan @lonelyowl13 @p @phnt @sendpaws @vicious bunny femcel