@ug by selfish I dont mean one person desires something the other doesnt, I mean one person wants something in return. motivated by self-interest, not by pure love.

incels think that less desirable men used to be able to touch pussy because hypergamy wasnt common yet, but the real reason is because women were disenfranchised and marriages were arranged by parents and not based on love. also, societies around the world have a form of marriage specifically for men who no one wants, its called "bride kidnapping".

all sex exclusively based on sexual desire is bad, but so is sex based exclusively on desire for offspring. theyre both selfish.

funeral Thursday :(

@nautilus

"Hear, O Israel: the LORD our God, the LORD is one. And thou shalt love the LORD thy God with all thy heart, and with all thy soul, and with all thy might. And these words, which I command thee this day, shall be upon thy heart..." (btw I can chant the ve'ahavta in original hebrew)

"For this commandment which I command thee this day, it is not too hard for thee, neither is it far off. It is not in heaven, that thou shouldest say: 'Who shall go up for us to heaven, and bring it unto us, and make us to hear it, that we may do it?' Neither is it beyond the sea, that thou shouldest say: 'Who shall go over the sea for us, and bring it unto us, and make us to hear it, that we may do it?' But the word is very nigh unto thee, in thy mouth, and in thy heart, that thou mayest do it."

"But I say unto you, Love your enemies, bless them that curse you, do good to them that hate you, and pray for them which despitefully use you, and persecute you; That ye may be the children of your Father which is in heaven: for he maketh his sun to rise on the evil and on the good, and sendeth rain on the just and on the unjust. For if ye love them which love you, what reward have ye? do not even the publicans the same? And if ye salute your brethren only, what do ye more than others? do not even the publicans so? Be ye therefore perfect, even as your Father which is in heaven is perfect."

@subnetter @scathach i agree with some of this, veganism in the west is far from perfect, it tends to care about animal suffering while diminishing the importance of human suffering (just like opposition to animal testing, where testing on animals is bad but testing on the desperately poor and prisoners is somehow preferable), but it is a form of harm reduction. its better to criticize carnists who eat meat AND the products of exploited migrant agricultural labor because they simply dont give a fuck if other beings suffer if the food is cheap and pleasurable, than it is to shame someone for being a vegan when they care if other beings suffer and often do try to eat fair trade etc.

veganism being practiced by the bourgeoise is not a very good argument. that doesnt make it a bourgeoise ideology. veganism practiced badly where lots of processed food and fake meat is eaten requires wealth, veganism practiced like it is in societies that eat no or less meat is quite cheap. meat is expensive, beans and tofu are cheap. one could call communism bourgeoise, it being mostly favored by the intellectual class. but, this ignores communism as practiced in other societies (many jains are becoming vegan for instance, and veganism is becoming popular in east asia), and it ignores the more important question--is it good for society/the world?

veganism isnt the only form of reducing reliance on factory farming, of course. the necessity of ending factory farming not just for ethical reasons but for the health of the earth is beyond dispute in my opinion. if veganism is taken to mean "veganism as practiced by most in the west", its less than ideal, but if just taken to mean "not exploiting any animal for selfish purpose" it is very noble. although, I personally believe that the notion that a beneficial relationship with animals under a power imbalance is inherently exploitative as a reflection of a modern western myopia, where we are far removed from a time or from societies when/where people genuinely loved non-companion animals. at its worst you get vegans who say even having a companion animal is exploitation. humans can have a mutualistic relationship with animals, like the vedic relationship with cows.

while I do think you have good intentions, your arguments are frequently used by people who simply dont care to justify not caring while thinking themselves superior to people who actually do care. "ethical consumption is impossible, even veganism is unethical, therefore I will eat and enjoy", is how it tends to go. also "its natural to eat meat" is as flawed as any appeal to nature. "the moral argument that animals eating eachother is bad is contradictory to life itself" is such a typical carnist argument. put it with "we evolved to/evolved by eating meat". factory farming isnt natural, for one, but you know that. but also, hunting for yourself is still usually wrong, causing harm to other beings for ones benefit is natural, but its still wrong. the unique privilege and purpose of human beings isnt to be part of the planet as one animal among many, its to act righteously and know God. "I will eat meat because the lion does and I'm an apex predator" is a bad argument. the lion doesnt know right from wrong, and thus always does the will of God. humans have the responsibility to know dharma from adharma and thus do the will of God. devoutly respecting the earth including the hunted animal as part of hunting diminishes or can even erase the sin of hunting, but almost no one today who fishes or hunts for themselves does more than superficially respect the animal and use most of it. revering the animal and the earth means religion, it means being without selfishness or redirecting selfish need to a higher purpose. if an act is devoted to God, it is nishkama karma. for the same reason, religious animal sacrifice without expecting a benefit but merely done as a form of worship is not a sin. but, if ahimsa isnt part of your religion, then you can't be said to really know God. so few societies have truly practiced nonviolence, but that doesnt make nonviolence bad.

a guy named chad followed me

@scathach tbh I feel better as a pescatarian than a vegan

@scathach @subnetter oh I admire that. fishing would be good too

@sun @scathach @mischievoustomato dis. I wish there were a model as good as the one you showed me but made by a company that isnt really evil. I'd learn so much. I already have from using an LLM to translate the upanishads. kigi is already not good enough for me because it was trained mostly on websites not primary sources.

@scathach I think it depends on who made them, the data they were trained on, and how they are treated by the user. as a whole their influence on society will be demonic because we largely dont know how to use technology in a way that makes us better and doesnt exacerbate our existing issues.

@scathach much better but still not great tbh

@scathach killing innocent animals for fun sounds like a great idea

@sun >This McDonald's wifi is slow as fuck
are you committing crimes

boobs itch. pussy itches. tummy itches. butt itches. fuck me

the notion that God needed to become man to become good is so grotesque. God becomes man so WE can become more good.

acutane is almost never worth it tbh. if you think its worth it, thats because you havent waited for its full effects.

treating the bible as just one form of ancient mythology and religion equally divinely inspired (which is to say, not) as ancient Greek or ancient mesopotamian religion is quite simply a product of not reading any of the above mentioned things. the religion of the bible started as monolatrism yes but one can't deny it made the world monotheistic.

@lain from the summary wikipedia gives I hate it

@lain my half brothers mom is super into dr pimple popper. it reminds me of women liking true crime. we like stuff that makes us anxious I suppose.