@agatha im a universalist 😎. the catholic church does forbid anything more than hopeful universalism, which is kinda stinky. it did not condemn this 1500 years ago to my knowledge though. are you talking about the second council of constantinople?
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@agatha this is not a categorical condemnation of apokatastasis! if read as such, this seems like an odd combination of two ideas.
but lets walk through pre-existence of souls. if the fall was from unity into many pre-existing souls, then the restoration would just be a reset to their initial, unified state, and the fall could just as easily happen again. this system gets elaborated on in later anathemas (especially 12 and 14) which clarifies the image of this blob theory of salvation. it kinda seems like an odd thing to anathematize, but so does the idea of perfected bodies being spherical, which sits sandwiched in the middle of these anathemas. they anathematized this bc it genuinely was what the “origenists” at the time believed, and is indeed a monstrous restoration that follows
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elizabeth worm🔅
lizzie@brain.worm.pink
@coolbean @agatha @annamaria it took me way too long to realize why you cced anna 😭
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elizabeth worm🔅
lizzie@brain.worm.pink
@agatha @coolbean @annamaria no. anna’s old @ was anathema. insofar as there is a religion niche on fedi i am probably part of it though. i mostly post about really though
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georgia
georgia
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@agatha i mean i was talking about the anathemas against origen so i dont see why what i said wouldn’t address that. anyway whether or not the anathemas actually anathematize universalism actually does have weight bc there are churches that arent roman catholic who count the fifth council
also im protestant so while i am mot required to affirm tje council, i like to have a proper understanding of the tradition before me
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gatita con frijoles 
coolbean@brain.worm.pink
like luce, lizzie, patchuun and anna all to varying degrees
i cant really relate tho i grew up atheist and am dabbling with just the mildest hints of buddhism but im kinda bad at it i just agree with the cosmology
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gatita con frijoles
coolbean@brain.worm.pink
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#1 Lena Castration Fan
annamaria@shrimptest.bedwetting.club
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elizabeth worm🔅
lizzie@brain.worm.pink
@coolbean @agatha @annamaria we need to bring that back tbh
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elizabeth worm🔅
lizzie@brain.worm.pink
@georgia imo, things only have an eternal end through their eternal beginning in the logos, but this is not considered to be the individual soul. this is part of why i was saying buddha-nature in mahayana thought us not considered a pre-existing soul in christian thinking
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elizabeth worm🔅
lizzie@brain.worm.pink
@georgia i think a lot of the reason i mostly hang around orthodox christians on twitter is that western christian traditions really just do not care about this stuff as much and i very much do
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